The 2-Hour Lifestyle Lawyer: EU 110 with Laura Cowan
I recently sat down with Laura Cowan, the creator of the 2-Hour Lifestyle Lawyer and one of the first people to pioneer an online-based model for her industry. We spoke about how her online program helps lawyers build their own lifestyle practices.
This market is hot right now, there’s a lot of demand. And Laura is a prime person to speak about it.
In 2016, Laura opened her estate planning practice in New York with no clients, no experience, and no financial safety net. Seeing as how this is one of the most competitive markets, it was not easy to start from scratch. Within 6 years, she has perfected a model that has brought her success to this day: getting consistent business, converting clients, and doing it all without working a ton of hours.
Laura’s program teaches lawyers how to have a profitable estate planning practice that can add $10K/month to your bottom line working just 2 hours a day. And as an added bonus, you can work from wherever you want.
In such a competitive market, how can this be possible? Find out in this episode.
You can connect with Laura here.
Why estate planning? [4:45]
The evolution from building an estate planning practice to how it works now. [8:11]
How events can be used as a conversion mechanism?[10:39]
Why blogs don’t work for estate planning lawyers? [15:17]
The 2-Hour Lifestyle Lawyer Model. [18:26]
… and much more!
EU 110 audio
[00:00:00] Laura Cowan:
There’s a lot of benefits to being an estate planning attorney. You can get up and running pretty quickly. You can bill a flat fee. You don’t have to go to court. You’ve got complete control over your schedule, and now you can do it virtually. It’s a unicorn practice area for those reasons, and I think there’s a lot of lawyers out there who are looking to add a practice area that they can easily add an extra $10,000 a month to their bottom line.
Doing work that helps people from anywhere without working a ton of hours. And so that’s what the two Hour Lifestyle Lawyer is all about.
This is experts unleashed, revealing how professionals and entrepreneurs transform experience into income while positively impacting the world.
For years, Joel Erway has helped entrepreneurs develop and launch their expert based businesses growing them beyond six and even seven figures a year. Now a professional expert serves their community through paid training education or service. This podcast will help you design and execute your plan to become a six or seven figure expert without a massive team.
To get more information or apply now, visit theperfectexpert.com. Let’s get started.
[00:01:17] Joel Erway:
Hey, what’s going on everybody? Joel iWay here and welcome to another very special episode of Experts Unleashed. I am super, super excited. I’ve got my good friend Laura Cowen. On the call here today from the two-hour lifestyle lawyer. Now, Laura and I have worked together over the past couple of months, and I’ve gotten to know her.
I’ve gotten to know her business. I’ve gotten to know what she does for her clients, and she works in the legal space Now. I wanted to have her on the show because, Over the course of our conversations over the past few months, I’ve seen what she’s been doing in the legal space, specifically helping lawyers and anyone in the legal space, you know, build their own lifestyle practice.
And she has something called the two-hour Lifestyle Lawyer. Now, you know, I had her on and I want to bring her on this show because yeah, it’s a really, really cool concept, and especially over the course of the past two or three years. Lots of different industries have shifted to remote based, online based, and she was one of the first to kind of pioneer the model.
And so that got me really, really excited. I know that her market is really, really excited. It’s hot right now. She’s a lot of demand for what she’s teaching, especially with the two hour lifestyle lawyer. And so I wanted to have her on the show and just kind of dive into it a little bit and talk about her system, talk about what makes it unique, talk about why the market is so ready for this.
And I’m really, really excited. You are going to love this interview. And without further ado, Laura, welcome to the show.
[00:02:46] Laura Cowan:
Thank you for having me. Very excited to be here.
[00:02:49] Joel Erway:
So give us a little bit of background. You know, you’ve got this thing called the two Hour Lifestyle Lawyer. What is the two Hour Lifestyle Lawyer?
It sounds pretty self-explanatory, but break it down for us a little bit.
[00:03:01] Laura Cowan:
Yeah. So this is a program that teaches lawyers how to have a profitable estate planning practice without working a ton of hours, right? So it’s a, it’s a program that teaches lawyers how to practice estate planning, how to do it virtually, if that’s what they.
And how to make at least $10,000 a month working just a couple of hours a day. And so that’s what the two Hour Lifestyle Lawyer is about. It’s about having a healthy profit and also having a life.
[00:03:29] Joel Erway:
Why specifically estate planning? Is it just like one of those things in the legal space that’s really, really high demand right now?
Like, but you know, why did you niche down and focus on specifically estate?
[00:03:43] Laura Cowan:
Yeah, so I’m an estate planning attorney myself. I opened my practice in New York City in November of 2016, and I started from scratch. I did not have any clients, no experience doing estate planning, no financial safety net. And I decided to hang a shingle and become an estate planning attorney.
And that was the hardest thing I’ve ever done, hands down, very competitive legal market, and I’ve been doing that for the past six. And so I’m an estate planning attorney in New York and I’ve been very successful. I’ve been doing this for six years now, and it’s a, a model that I’ve perfected myself, the model of getting, getting business, getting clients getting them to convert and doing it, not working a ton of hours.
And so that’s what I’m teaching other lawyers how to do, how to replicate my success in a really competitive legal market without a lot of help or assistance, frankly. I did it all myself.
[00:04:39] Joel Erway:
So like why did you choose estate planning? You said it was very competitive, right? You know, why did you decide to go into that niche?
[00:04:46] Laura Cowan:
Yeah, so estate planning is a great practice area for so many reasons, and it’s become an even better practice area post covid. So there’s a lot of benefits to being an estate planning attorney. You can bill a flat fee so you don’t have to bill anything by the hour, right? You don’t have to go to court, you don’t have to do litigation.
You can help people, right? This is a great thing. It’s pretty easy to get up to speed on the state planning on the law, assuming you’re not serving people who have a taxable. And it’s something that you can do virtually now, which we definitely couldn’t do pre 2020. The estate planning practice that I built in, in 2016 pre covid is very different than the practice that I have now, but it’s kind of a unicorn practice area for those reasons.
You can get up and running pretty quickly. You can bill a flat fee. You don’t have to go to court. You’ve got complete control over your schedule, and now you can do it virtually if you want to and if you don’t want to and you want to have people come to your office, that’s fine. But it’s a unicorn practice area for those reasons.
And I think there’s a lot of lawyers out there who are looking to add a practice area that they can easily add an extra $10,000 a month to their bottom line doing work that helps people from anywhere without working a ton of hours. And so that’s what the two Hour Lifestyle Lawyer is all.
[00:06:06] Joel Erway:
I think one of the things that you mentioned is really, really important, obviously you know, I have experienced in business and I, and I’ve toyed around with the idea of like, people ask me if I can bill by the hour and, and whatever, and I’ve always rejected it.
Right? And so you talk about, you know, estate planning allows you to charge flat fees. That has to be critical with like designing a lifestyle practice. Cause you’re not, you’re not tied to some hourly rate. How common is that in the legal. To bill hourly in other niches in the legal space. Yeah.
[00:06:36] Laura Cowan:
Other areas of law you, it’s not possible to bill a flat fee and I’ve only ever practiced estate planning, so I’m not overly familiar, but I know if you’re doing any kind of litigation, you’ve got to bill by the hour because you just don’t know how long it’s going to take.
Estate planning, you have a flat fee. You quote quoted upfront; the client pays in you draft and design the estate plan and then you’re done. And it really lends itself to that flat fee model. Yeah.
[00:07:03] Joel Erway:
That’s awesome. I love it. So you mentioned, you know, adding $10,000 per month to someone’s bottom line, just a couple hours per day.
It’s fast to get up to speed. Right. What about your model, like when, when you got into this in 2016? How did you start? meaning like, you know, what did you try to do to get clients? Like, how did you start to build your practice in 2016 and take us through that journey of like what you had to learn, what was, you know, what was commonplace back then and what you thought was true.
How did that evolve? How did that shift? So take us through that journey from 2016 to where we are now in almost 2023 and I. Kind of just learn how that evolved into what has become the two hour lifestyle lawyer. Cause that’s, by the way, it’s an awesome name, like. Yeah.
[00:07:53] Laura Cowan:
I think your team helped me come up with that name, by the way.
[00:07:56] Joel Erway:
Yeah. Yeah. Maybe we might have, we might have had our, our hand in it.
[00:07:58] Laura Cowan:
Yeah. It’s a great name. No, I’m glad that you asked that because everything is different. Everything is different now between 2016 and 2023. Right. When I first opened my law practice, I was taught you had to have a website. you have to have your blogs and you’ve got to do your newsletters.
And all of the meetings that we had were in person because it just wasn’t socially acceptable to do any of this virtually. Back in 2016, we had the technology, but it wasn’t socially acceptable and I was really encouraged to try to build a million dollar law practice. And so that was 2016. And the, the, the one thing that I still do from 2016 is I get business by holding events, right?
So that’s the one piece of the puzzle that has stuck. But all the other pieces of the puzzle, blogs, newsletters having a website that looks like a brochure that doesn’t really convert, trying to build a million dollar law. None of that is what the two hour Lifestyle Lawyer is about. We encourage people to get business by funneling them to a webinar, whether live or on demands.
No one reads blogs anymore. No one reads newsletters anymore, right? We just want to move people right to that educational event, that webinar where you can educate a lot of people in one setting and get them to take that next step in the process. So, That’s, that’s a big piece of the puzzle. And then working virtually and having consistent $10,000 a month revenue while also having time for a family.
Mm-hmm. . So that’s how the two hour Lifestyle lawyer is, is very different from the practice that I was building in 2016. It’s our goal to get our lawyers making $10,000 a month, working a couple of hours a. By hosting educational events and getting people to those events. Not by running expensive Facebook ads, but just by advertising locally in your community.
[00:09:57] Joel Erway:
Amazing. So the only thing that kind of held true over the past seven years has been events. Events have been your conversion mechanism, right?
[00:10:08] Laura Cowan:
Yes, exactly. That’s a very good way of putting it. That’s the only thing that’s held true is events.
[00:10:13] Joel Erway:
is that commonplace? You know, do most lawyers know they need to do events or is that kind of, I, is that new to them?
Like, do they think that they get business through other mediums or do they know they need to do some sort of, some sort of event?
[00:10:28] Laura Cowan:
I think a lot of lawyers, you, you want to feel like there’s one magic bullet, right? Like, what’s the one thing that I can do that’s really going to bring in a ton of business and there is no magic bullet, right?
Every month I do get business from people who find me online and referrals from prior clients and my b and i group, and from my events, it, it comes from all different places. The reason why events work so well in estate. And when I say events, I mean either in-person seminars or webinars. It’s because there’s an educational component to, to getting estate planning clients.
If you’re used to getting business as a personal injury attorney or a D U I attorney, the way you get business for those is is by running a lot of expensive ads, right? And people are ready to hire you. They’re in a position of pain. They, they’re, they’re ready to write you a check. It’s not like that with estate.
People aren’t necessarily ready to hire you, they’re not even necessarily ready to have a meeting with you, right? They’re the, the most they can commit in the beginning is just to attend an educational event. And so it allows you to give them some basic information to nurture them to the next step in the process, which is to have a consultation with you.
And the mistake that most lawyers make when they hold webinars is they spend, you know, half an hour talking about estate planning and why you need an estate plan, et cetera. And then they don’t have any kind of a call to action. They feel like it’s very salesy to say anything else. So they just close with, well, if you have any questions, gimme a call.
And then no one ever calls because there’s no, there’s no drive to the next step. so initially what you’re doing is you’re just trying to get people to come to the event, right? You’re just selling the webinar, and then in the webinar, the next thing that you’re doing is you’re selling the consultation and all the benefits that they’re going to get from the consult.
and then you try to move people to that next step. And then only at the consultation do you actually start to sell the estate plan. And I think that most lawyers they have some sense that they should be doing events. And it depends on if you’ve been practicing estate planning before or not.
If you haven’t practiced estate planning, you, you may not have any, any sense for this, but I think that most lawyers, they’re either not doing events or they’re doing them, they’re doing them. Yeah. And what I mean by that is they’re not there’s no call to action. There’s no selling the benefits of the next step in the process because they feel like it’s salesy.
So if, if you’re an estate planning attorney, the one thing that’s held true these past seven years is it is the best way to get business. I mean, I held I’ve been doing this for seven years now, and I’ve had events where I’ve had only two people show up, and I’ve had events where a bunch of people signed up and no one showed up.
and I’ve had events where I did an event in April for a mom’s group here in New York City and they, they found me because they were looking for an attorney to speak to their 3000 moms in New York City about how to protect their children with guardians, because most of the parents in the group were from Israel.
and they their parents lived here. The families were in Israel, so they were worried who’s going to take care of our kids in the event that something happens to both parents. So they wanted guardians nominated. So the leader of this group found me. She asked if I would present, of course, I said yes, if anyone ever asked to say yes,
And I presented over a hundred people, signed up, over 70 people showed up, and I got over $80,000 of business from that one webinar. Now that’s way better than, than normal. Right? My success for that event kind of far exceeds my other events. But the point is if you can educate a lot of people in your target market at once and give them a strong call to action, which is to book out initial consultation with you, it’s like a faucet that you can turn on and off, right?
I actually haven’t done any events since April, and we’re now into December because I got so much business from that one. So instead of relying on other people, it’s good to get referrals. It’s good to have people find you online, but if you want to have control over, over how much business you have, you’ve got to start educating your community.
[00:14:38] Joel Erway:
Yeah. Amazing. So you’ve found the secret with acquiring and converting clients through, through events. You, you mentioned earlier that blogs don’t work anymore, newsletters don’t work anymore. Is that still. Pushed out there to, to lawyers as like, Hey, this is what you need to be doing. Or are people just kind of burying their head in the sand?
[00:15:03] Laura Cowan:
I think it’s being pushed a little bit, and I’m not going to say that they, that they don’t work. Right. It’s Why do you do blogs? Well, it’s, it’s for SEO o right? That’s the, the main thing. But I don’t necessarily think, as an estate planning attorney, you want to land at the top. Of, of Google. I think oftentimes when you land at the top of Google, you just end up with a lot of leaves that aren’t a good fit for you.
Right. And in terms of newsletters, it’s just not the same as it was in 2016. We, we get a million more emails now than we’ve ever gotten. People don’t really read them anymore. The one thing I would say is that if you, if you want to do a blog and you want to do a newsletter, just hire an inexpensive virtual assistant to do them for you.
Don’t spend a lot of money on it, is what I would say. what I teach my clients or my students, and what I encourage is just focus your efforts right now on hosting events, getting people to say yes, getting money in the bank, basically, right? Once you get that consistent and you’re starting to feel better about your bank account, Then you can worry about posting blogs and running newsletters and all of that.
It’s just not something that I think that you should really be focusing on in the beginning. It’s maybe step two, and you certainly shouldn’t be spending a lot of resources, and by resources, I mean money. Having someone paying someone to write blogs and send newsletters for you. Take that time, take that energy, take that money, and go straight to holding events.
That’s going to be the biggest bang for your.
[00:16:35] Joel Erway:
I think that’s so key too. And people have to understand efficiency is everything. When you’re breaking into a new market, you’re breaking into a new venture. You kind of mentioned it earlier. Everyone’s looking at that one silver bullet. Like, what’s the one thing that I can be doing that’s going to be, you know, that’s going to work for me.
You know, and, and it, and it’s also just not being naive and saying like, there’s only one thing and. Referrals don’t work and all this other stuff doesn’t work well, that all, that all takes time and reputation and brand building and whatnot, but it’s very clear that events are the way to go, right? Get people in, get them to know, like, and trust you.
Give them some education and you know, then invite them to the next step, right? People want to be led to the next step. Like you can’t be afraid of selling like they want to be led to, to the next step. If you can do that, then, then the rest is history, right? Then it’s just, that’s, that’s your conversion mechanism.
That’s what works. And, and I love to hear you say that, like, I’d love to hear you say like, that’s the one thing that you need to be doing is do events, do events, do events, do events, right? Let me ask you this, Laura. We’ve really kind of focused on like your conversion mechanism right now and like what works for marketing, what works for getting clients, but like, explain what the holistic two hour lifestyle lawyer model is like.
How do we fit an entire business model into two hours a day? Like obviously we’re running events to get clients, but you still got to, you still got to serve, you still got to, still got to fulfill. So how does the whole two hour lifestyle lawyer model work?
[00:18:07] Laura Cowan:
Yeah, so when I was putting all of this together to teach to other lawyers, I really thought hard about what are the pieces of this that allowed me to be so success.
Why have I been successful? I had to, you know, step back and think about that. And I think that there are three pieces to making a good income as an estate planning attorney without working a ton. And I, I’ve narrowed them down to Ace. And ACE stands for attracting leads, closing leads, and executing the work.
And you have to have all three pieces. You’ve got to be able to get leaves, which I recommend you do through webinars without spending a ton on ads. And we teach you how to do that, how to get people to show up to your events without spending a lot on ads. But then you’ve got to be able to close those leaves, right?
There’s no point spending time and money getting people into your office, so to speak, without having a system in place to actually getting them to say yes. And if you’re new to estate planning, , one of the things you’re going to learn pretty quickly is that it’s, it’s a little bit of a hurdle getting people to write you a check to do an estate plan, right?
Because you’ve got to get over though, well, why can’t I just do this on a legal zoom? Or do I even need an estate plan or can’t I just do it myself and, oh, the guy down the street’s charging Lyfts, right? So that C in the Ace, the close is a really big piece of the puzzle, and that’s one of the things that we teach.
And then the E is the executing. Right. So there’s, it’s great having all this extra business, but not if it keeps you tethered to the office until 10 o’clock at night. So you, as the attorney, should be focusing your efforts on the A and the C, right? The acquiring leads, educating your community, holding events, holding webinars, and then C, getting those leads to convert.
And then everything that happens after that should be outsourced, delegated Right. So a lot of the work that comes after you’ve gotten the business in terms of drafting the documents that can be outsourced to a rockstar paralegal. Now, I’m not saying that you don’t review the documents after they’ve been drafted, but you as the attorney don’t necessarily have to do the drafting.
There’s drafting software that will help you with that, and you can hire a really great paralegal to do a big chunk of the drafting for you. And then in terms of automation, a lot of things have changed. A lot of attorneys are doing the, the document review, for example, when you review the documents with the client, instead of doing those one-to-one even via Zoom with each individual clients, a lot of attorneys are pre-recording a review video using technology that we have today.
Loom very easy and expensive technology and then just sending that video as opposed to sitting with every client over and over again, going over the same documents, over and over. And so the way that two Hour Lifestyle lawyer works is that you as the attorney, are spending your time only on things that generate revenue, right?
So educating your community, holding events, posting webinars, presenting, and then getting people into your office, so to speak, and getting them to say yes. And then a lot of the things that happen around that, and after that are done by a paralegal. They’re automated, they’re out. and what most lawyers get wrong is that they, they spend too much time on the e the executing and not enough time on the acquiring and the closing.
[00:21:30] Joel Erway:
How much on average is each estate planning client worth?
[00:21:35] Laura Cowan:
Yeah, so it depends on where you live. I would say between twenty five hundred and forty five hundred you know, give or take a little bit. I live in New York City. My average fee is about 4,500. Most of my clients do a trust for 4,500. Now, I recognize that I’m in the middle of New York City, but I have students who are in Montana, who are in rural Maine, who are charging 3,500 for a trust.
Yeah, and it’s worth every penny. That’s something else that we teach in the course. It’s not just about what you can charge. Well, what is the client getting for it once you’re able to convey to your prospect. That it’s actually going to be more expensive for them not to have you do a trust for them than it is to do a trust for them.
Then they’re not going to bulk at a $3,500 fee. Right? But that’s something that you need to be taught. That’s something that we teach in our course. How do you convey your value to prospects so they don’t say, oh, I didn’t think it was going to cost that much.
[00:22:30] Joel Erway:
And so it really boils down to really just needing three or four clients a month to kind of hit.
That 10 k per month, you know, mark. And if you are able to delegate it and build, you know, a rockstar small team to help execute it, I mean, , you’re living the dream baby. Like, that’s, that’s it, right? I mean it’s, you know, it sounds simple, but where do most people get hung up? You said earlier that a lot of times they, they spend too much time fulfilling and they spend too much time like actually executing the work.
Why is that? Are they afraid to delegate it? Like, you know, is it kind of like an identity crisis of like, no, I’m the expert. Like I have to be like, they bought me. I have to be the one doing it. Is there a little. of that or what’s the hang up with what you see in your space?
[00:23:18] Laura Cowan:
Yeah, and, and I will just kind of clarify one thing and that is, you know, the goal here is not to provide anything less than amazing legal work.
Mm-hmm. and legal documents. What I always tell my, my students is you know, you shouldn’t be wasting your time answering the phone or wasting your time. Necessarily inputting the data into the drafting software, you spending time on that means that you’re not able to focus your attention laser-like on your clients, right?
So you want to think about when you call the doctor, right? And you schedule an appointment, you, you, no, the doctor doesn’t answer the phone. , the doctor doesn’t take your weight when you get there and take your blood pressure and all those things. All those things are done by other people so that when a doctor finally comes in, he or she can do exactly what they went to medical school to do.
And it’s the same thing with attorneys. So I’m not in any way proposing that we kind of shirk our responsibilities. What I’m saying is you, you let the things that can be done by someone without a law degree do those things so that you as a lawyer, Can focus laser-like on solving your client’s problems and counseling them and drafting them custom legal documents.
So I just want to make that that really, really clear. And then the other thing is that where do people get hung off? That, that’s a great question. I think it’s, I ask this in my discovery calls when I go through the ACE roadmap and I ask my. Students or people who are on the discovery call, you know, where do you need the most help?
Is it, do you need help acquiring leads, attracting leads? Or maybe you’re getting caught up on closing those people. You’re getting people in the office, but you’re not able to charge what you’re worth and you’re hearing, you know, a lot of, I need to think about it or, Is it that you don’t have any systems in place?
Is it executing the work you’re doing? Everything. And I ask them, tell me which one of these you need the most help with. And I think it’s such a fun thing to ask because it’s always 30% each. It’s like always no one letter is where people need the most help. You know, a third of the people on the call will say, I need help with the a.
A third will say, I need help closing. And a third will say, I need help with the executing. So That just kind of confirms to me that it’s, it says you have to have all three pieces of the system to be successful, and I think that’s one of the things that makes the two hour Lifestyle lawyer program a little bit different.
There’s people out there advertising to attorneys and they’re advertising either we’ll get you a ton of leads, but they’re not teaching you how to close those leads and they’re not teaching you how to manage the extra work. Or there’s people. I don’t know if there’s anyone actually teaching you how to close, but then there’s other people teaching you how to, like, here’s some systems that you can have in place, right?
Here’s A A C R M, or here’s whatever software. And so they’ve got that piece. But there’s no point in having software if you don’t have any clients, right? You need to have all three pieces, and I really think that only all three pieces can be taught by an estate planning. who was actually seen and done all three pieces.
So it’s a matter of dialing in each the A, the C and the E.
[00:26:24] Joel Erway:
Yeah. Yeah, that makes total sense. Who are the most common types of people to come work with you? Like we’re looking at, you know, lawyers, paralegals, like kind of paint the picture of, of who makes up your, your client base that, that you know, that work with you to learn the two hour lifestyle lawyer.
[00:26:42] Laura Cowan:
My students are only lawyers. Although having said that, if you’re an attorney looking to implement our accelerated implementation program, you can bring a staff member. Right? But we’re teaching attorneys and what we find is that we’ve got a few different buckets. We’ve got attorneys who are coming to us who are want to add estate planning as a practice area.
who are new to the area because for example, they’ve been in litigation and they’re tired of litigating, they’re tired of court. They want to have all the benefits of estate planning that we spoke about earlier. So we get attorneys trying to get away from litigation. We get attorneys who’ve been doing estate planning for a while who just aren’t having the success that they want.
right. So either they’re, you know, I, I have attorneys in the group who been practicing for 25 years, the estate planning, who are learning, they’re some of my very best students. They’re learning so much because they’ve just kind of been stuck in doing things a certain way and, and they just need some guidance on how to kind of update things.
So we get attorneys who’ve been practicing estate planning for a while. We have attorneys in the program who’ve never practiced estate planning, and that’s fine too because we have a module and coaching. For students who are brand new to estate planning, so we’re going to teach you the basics of estate planning.
but then also have ongoing coaching with an estate planning and drafting coach. So as you’re learning estate planning and you’re starting to get more clients in the door and you’ve got questions as you’re drafting the documents, we’ll help you with that. So a attorneys of all. Different kind of walks of life and as we’ve even got people in the program, I think this is one of the most common groups, actually, attorneys who are nearing retirement, and they don’t necessarily want to just quit cold Turkey.
They want to have something that they can do in retirement. This is the perfect program for that. You service 2, 3, 4 clients a month. You get an extra $10,000, which is a lot of money, and you’re not working a ton of hours. You’re setting your own schedule. . It’s a great, it’s a great tool to have in your tool belt.
I think one of the things that is so nice about estate planning that brought me a lot of comfort when I opened my practice was that I felt like no matter what, I’m always going to have this I’m always going to be able to make money selling estate plans, right? Hmm. I’ll always have that. I can be 70 years years old and if I need income, I can, I can do some estate plans.
And so all you need is help getting up and running and not recreating the. it’s just going to fast track your success. So this program is just, will fast track your success so that you can get started up and running, having this as a weapon in your tool belt. Yep. To always be able to help people.
[00:29:17] Joel Erway:
How long does it normally take someone to get their first meaningful result, though, let’s say they right.
I, Laura, I’m, I’m all in like, let’s, let’s do the two hour lifestyle lawyer. , what does that roadmap look like for them to, I’m assuming the first big win for them is to, is to start generating leads for their first live event. Is that correct?
[00:29:37] Laura Cowan:
Yeah, that’s the first step. And that’s, that’s the thing that we really harp on is we give you a lot of information.
We give you all the, the tools and the steps to take the client all the way down to the end. But if you’re just going to focus on one thing right now, just focus on getting your first event on the calendar. Schedule a webinar, schedule an in-person event, drive some traffic to it, and then host that event and then drive people to the, to the consultation.
That’s your first big win. One of my, my students in rural Maine, that was one of her testimonials. You know, she, she did her first webinar, then she lives in this small town in Maine. It’s like this, you know, hallmark holiday Christmas town in Maine that she lives in. Very small town, but she had, she was so excited.
She held her first webinar and she had 27 people sign up and she got two clients from it. So that’s $7,000 in revenue. Yeah. And at the end of her testimonial, she said, you know, thank you so much for pushing me outside my comfort zone. And I understood that because it’s very, very scary holding at events, either in person or with a webinar.
And I get that because I was terrified, my very first. Right. So, but that’s the big hurdle that you’ve got to get over because once you feel comfortable doing it and you’ve done a couple, and you’ve gotten a couple of clients out of it, then you’re always going to be able to, to have this as a revenue generating activity as an asset.
[00:31:02] Joel Erway:
Yeah. Let me ask you this, I mean, because these people are y your clients, your students are all doing these in their local area or however they’re promoting. You can probably give them the webinar, right? I mean, you can probably give them the exact training that they need. They don’t have to create anything like you’re giving it to them.
Is that correct?
[00:31:23] Laura Cowan:
Yeah. They’re getting a webinar in a box basically, and because I want them to get up and running, doing webinars as soon as possible, I’m just giving them my webinar. In fact, the same webinar that I used to generate $80,000 in revenue from. Parents group that I spoke to in April, it’s about 90 slides.
I give you the slides in the script and you’re free to tinker with them. There might be a little bit of differences in your webinar based on your own state law, but I don’t want you getting hung up on now. I’ve got to create this whole presentation. Yeah, take mine, tweak it as you want to. Done is better than perfect.
That’s always the expression. Entrepreneurial community. Yep. Just, just get going. Just get a couple under your belt and I’ll give you everything you need to, to get going. And, and you know, the big fear that my students have is that they’re going to host this event and no one’s going to show up. And the, the same thing that I tell them I’ll tell you, which is, you know, first of all, you can, the software allows you to kind of hide how many participants there are.
So if you’re really, really nervous about that, And you’ve only got two people show up to your webinar. Those two people are not going to know. They’re the only two people. Right. So that’s just a little, a little trick that I’ll tell you. But the more important thing is that, and I think I mentioned this earlier, even if you only get a couple people show up, they might both hire you.
I, I mean, I had a student in in Texas who were very first webinar. She only had two people show up and they both hired her.
[00:32:49] Joel Erway:
as someone who does webinars for a living, running the webinar agency. Right. It’s. , every single attendee there is worth whatever your value is that you’re selling. So if it’s a $3,500, you know, offer a $4,500 offer.
If you only have one person there or two people there, like, do everything in your power to make sure they know that you can specifically help them. The fewer their, the people that are in the wo in the room, like use that to your advantage. Speak directly to them like intimacy increases your conversion.
More than anything else in the world. So if you can literally speak directly to them, call them by name and ask them specific questions, like the odds of you signing them are going to go through the roof. So everyone wants to have a 4 million person event where they can sell, sell the lights out, right? And they also think that like the smallest events are the, are the least valuable.
It’s like no turn, turn every situation into an opportunity. Intimacy is the best way to increase convers.
[00:33:49] Laura Cowan:
It really is, it is not an ego thing. Like this is not a, oh, only five people signed up, so that means I’m not good at what I do or whatever. Don’t think of it that way. I, I mean, I think I gave the example, one of my first events that I held in person, I had only three people show up, but all three of them hired me.
And so we had four people sitting in the room. And of course I was a little bit embarrassed cause I had like 15 people rsvp, but only three showed. , they clearly didn’t care cause all three of them hired me. So, you know, don’t worry about if you get three people at your event, you might very well get $10,000 out of business from it.
So just get started.
[00:34:24] Joel Erway:
Yeah. And you want to talk about the highest leverage of your time. There you go. Right. So like you have to just shift that perspective from, oh, I only have X number of people in my room to know. How can I make this a $10,000 per hour? , right? How can I make $10,000 this hour? How can I make $5,000 this hour?
And I promise you, you have the highest probability of doing that with you know, a smaller room. Because you can make it, you can make it intimate. I love it. Yeah, it’s great advice. So Laura, what is the number one thing? Like your number one most common question that you get from somebody who’s interested in joining the two hour lifestyle lawyer.
Is it, what if nobody shows up because you, I think you kind of alluded to that. I, is that the number one question?
[00:35:11] Laura Cowan:
I think that’s the biggest concern that people have. is how to drive traffic to their events. And so we’ve got an entire module that talks about that. And we’re building out even more. I mean, we’re building out this program to make our students as successful as possible.
And so I’m always tweaking it. I’m always improving it. But that’s one of the things that we do spend a lot of time on is how to get people to show up to your event without spending a lot of money on ads. Yep. And. The way that we teach this is now, I’m not opposed to running Facebook ads. They’ve got their place but they’re very expensive and I don’t really think that they work all that well for generating estate planning leads.
So what we teach instead is reaching out to local groups in your community and offering to present or buying advertising space with those groups. So for example, I live in New York City. There’s a group here I market to parents of minor children, right? That’s my target and there’s a million parents groups in New York and, and one of them, I really love that, that you can buy an email that gets sent out to 10,000 parents who live in Brooklyn for about $150.
And so you get 300, which is like dirt sheet price. It’s so inexpensive. And so you get you get about 300 words or 300 letters, whatever it is, and you, you just, you advertise your upcoming webinar, you get people to click at a minimum you’re going to get their email address so you can nurture to them.
This is going to work better than any, any Facebook ad. So there’s groups like this in your area. I’m not saying you’re not going to have any ad spend, but you’re going to have a very low ad spend. And if you’re thinking, well, how do I find these groups? Or how do I get in front of them? This is what your rockstar virtual assistant is going to do.
Hire someone whose job it is to book speaking events for you. Right? Yeah.
[00:37:05] Joel Erway:
It’s funny, like there’s so many people who create problems that don’t. Right. And that’s like, that’s what I see when people are, are considering joining a program. Like, well, you know, how am I going to drive traffic? I like, that’s what I’m going to going to teach you.
What if nobody shows up? That’s what I’m going to teach you. It’s like, you know, they’re creating problems that don’t get exist. Like you haven’t done your first event yet. Like you could have 15 people there. Right. But they start to create these problems that are, that are downstream, that don’t get exist, and, and they just create anxiety that’s not, that’s not worth it.
And. This has been a fantastic conversation. So, Laura, before we, before we wrap up, I want you to brag a little bit, right? Because you’ve got dozens of students who’ve gone through you know, your, your first couple of cohorts. You’re, you are ramping up. There’s clearly demand. Brag about some of your best students, your best, you know, your best clients that have gone through the program that maybe somebody who didn’t think they could run events or maybe somebody who didn’t think they could, you know, delegate this out and, and really build a two hour lifestyle lawyer model.
take a couple minutes and, and, and brag about some of your star students.
[00:38:09] Laura Cowan:
Yeah. Well, it’s sort of funny because I’ve, I’ve taken. 60 lawyers now through this and, and I’m always asking for feedback in terms of, you know, did this work, has that worked? Let me know. And I think that my students are a little bit shy sometimes about, about telling me their successes.
But I had one of my students posted in our Facebook group the other day. you know, because of your training, I used to charge like $1,500 for a living trust or something. Some really, really, really low number. And because of your training, I’m now charging almost 4,000. Yeah. Which is. A huge win because most attorneys, they want to charge more.
They just don’t have the skills and the training to, to learn how to quote their fees and when to quote them and how to show the prospect the benefit of working with them, et cetera. So if you can raise your fees from 1500 to 4,000, I was so happy to hear that. I had another student who. Was really, really quiet during class and all the modules and everything.
I didn’t really hear much from her and I was like, ah, just, you know, it’s just sinking in and whatnot. And, and then all of a sudden she sends me an email saying, I’m hosting my first webinar and I have 40 people signed up and, you know, can you go over the peace of mind planning session with me? Like I, I know I’m going to be getting some business from this.
And, and so she and she’s a brand new estate planning attorney, just opened her practice. So that was a, a big win. And. Yeah, we’re seeing, we’re seeing students who are, who are increasing their fees, who are actually getting people to show up to their events. We’re seeing a lot of success. So it’s a great program.
The, the, the thing that’s great about it is that we give you all of the tools that you need in the training. We’ve got the course right, and you can, you can just take the course and get all the information, but then we have three months of ongoing support as well, and that support is in the area of technology.
estate planning and learning how to draft, and then just overall the overall systems. So you’re going to be, be getting all the tools and all the support that you need to be successful at at launching this as a practice area, or if you’ve been doing it a while, maybe doing it a little bit differently and, and seeing better results.
[00:40:17] Joel Erway:
You know, see it’s the ultimate shortcut, right? It’s how many layers of value can, can you outline in here? Like number one, maybe you don’t know how to, how to raise your fees. Well, there you go. Like how to go from 1500 bucks to four $4,500, right? If that’s the only thing that you got, it’s going to more than pay for itself.
You know, if you learned how to host events or how to give an event, Inspires people to take that next step to you. Cause most people know, you know, are, they don’t know how to present that call to action. And they give away great, free content, but nobody signs up. Well, that’s just a waste of time, right?
So if you learn how to give an effective sales presentation without being salesy and encourage people to take the next step with you and schedule that, you know, that strategy. That’s clearly going to be, you know, worth the investment. And so it’s like you just start to stack on all these different things and then, you know, getting it all delivered to you at once, where now you don’t have to go learn on your own.
You’ve got everything hand delivered to you so you know exactly what to do in what in the right order. That’s what these implementation programs are, are, are designed for. I’m really excited to hear all of your students having success, and I’m excited to hear to see your success and growing this program is really, really exciting.
And that’s why I was happy to have you on and, and excited to, to chat with you. And so where can people learn more about the two hour lifestyle lawyer? Let’s drop some links. Let’s, let’s send people to to go check you out.
[00:41:43] Laura Cowan:
Yeah, so everyone has to go through a discovery zoom with me. Not everyone qualifies for the program.
We want to make sure that you’re, you’re the right fit for it. And so the way to schedule a discovery zoom is just to go to my website, which is 2hourlifestylelawyer.com, and that’s the number two. So number two, hour lifestyle lawyer.com. And there you’ll be able to pick a time to schedule a discovery zoom.
And this is probably going to be a, a small group session with maybe three or four other attorneys, just so I can kind of get to know each of you. But in that call, we’ll talk about your goals and what you’re hoping to get out of the program and where you’re hoping to transition your practice.
And then I’ll talk all about the program and what’s, what’s involved and what the, the modules are, the training, the coaching, and how much it costs. And so that. The, the, the best way to learn more and to get going on this. We do limit our cohorts to a certain number of attorneys each, each time.
So you know, definitely make sure you book that discovery, zoom and get the information you need to get started. And we’re always kind of tweaking and improving the course. The, the only thing that matters to me is the success of my students, right? So I’m constantly refining to try to make sure that everyone is getting the success that they.
[00:43:02] Joel Erway:
I love it, Laura. It’s been amazing. Always great to connect with you. So we’ll drop those links down in the show notes and, and send people to go check out your stuff. But if you’re considering, you know, Adopting the two hour lifestyle lawyer model. I highly encourage you to reach out to Laura, connect with her, hop on one of those discovery sessions.
I promise you it’s worth everything that, that we’ve talked about here. So Laura, thanks for jumping on. Thanks for chatting with me for a little bit and we’ll talk soon.
[00:43:28] Laura Cowan:
Thank you. Bye.
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