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Dog Trainers Hate Him – Alfred Karlsen | #122

Tags: B2C, Dog Trainer, power offer

“Does the Power Offer work for B2C?” It’s one of the most common questions I get. My answer is usually something along the lines of, “if people buy stuff in your market, the Power Offer will work.”

My guest for this episode of Sold With Webinars –Alfred Karlsen– is a perfect example. He’s a dog trainer who sells high ticket online coaching programs for dog owners.

I invited Alfred on to teach me about the dog owner market, how they respond to the Power Offer, and the results he’s seeing with his paid traffic.

You’ll Discover

  • Alfred’s first online business coach taught him to focus on organic marketing – how did that go for him? And how did he feel about it? [02:05]

  • Dog trainers hate him! How Alfred’s scientific, anti-woo approach has earned him enemies in the dog training community [03:16]

  • Why “High Ticket” is relative to the niche you’re in… but you can still sell $1k, $3k, and $5k+ packages [07:57]

  • Alfred’s hesitations and concerns before joining High Ticket Courses… and what happened to his business after he joined [13:03]

  • Alfred’s mental model of marketing before and after he discovered the Power Offer [18:28]

…And much more!

Helpful Resources

Join our free Facebook group, Million Dollar Course Marketers.

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Subscribe to the podcast: Youtube, Apple podcasts, Google podcasts, Stitcher.

Follow Joel on social media: Facebook, Instagram, Linkedin.

Episode Transcript

Joel Erway: [00:00:00]

When you discovered the power offer, right. Was that like, did it make sense to you? Did you, did you trust it? Were you skeptical of it? Like, what was your, what was your opinion of the power offer that when you first learned about it?

Hey, what’s going on, everybody Joel Erway here. Welcome to another very special episode of Sold With Webinars. I am super, super jazzed up today. Super excited. I’ve got my man. I’ve got a good friend, a client of mine, Alfred Karlsen on the call today. And we’re going to be talking about his journey through online marketing, his journey through online business because he’s in a very unique niche that you have not yet heard me talk about on this podcast.

So Alfred, before jumping into it, welcome to this show, my man, excited to have you on.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:00:55]

Thank you. Excited to be here.

Joel Erway: [00:00:58]

So why don’t you give our audience, our listeners, a little bit of background about who you are, what your background is, what you do online.

And let’s just have some fun with this.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:01:08]

Alright. So my name is Alfred Karlsen and I help people with their dogs online. So from earlier on, I own a physiotherapy clinic and that’s been my bread and butter. And then I went to transition online because I have a passion for dogs and I’ve been working with dogs for a long while.

But I really didn’t know how to sell online. That was like a big thing for me. So, way back, like in 2015, I started trying to sell online and I started trying to make the dog business a viable online business, but that turned into me doing explainer videos of all things. So how do you sales didn’t really go really well?

And I made a lot more money off the physiotherapy, so I just dropped that and I joined another group for, for learning to sell like the dog training online, which was really, really good. Like these guys are super awesome, but they focus heavily on organic marketing. And even though that sounds so amazing, like he had just got a lot of clients and doesn’t spend any money on getting clients, it’s so much work.

It’s so much work. I like posting and editing videos every single day. And I did it. So, it actually did pay for, for your course. So that was cool. But as soon as I got like, got a hang of the power offers, and I can’t really say I have a hang of it yet, because I’m still testing different stuff all the time, but every single angle I’ve tried with the power offers and organically, or not organically, I’ve had sales and every single one.

So that’s really cool. So that’s where I come from.

Joel Erway: [00:03:10]

Dog trains are pretty broad, right? Do you specialize in a certain type of dog training?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:03:17]

Well, no. The thing is when it comes to dog training, a lot of people, a lot of people, they get results when they are in class with a trainer, but then when they leave training, they don’t keep the results, but the results will fade away after like two or three weeks.

And it’s because like a lot of dog trainers would talk about energy. Like yeah, watch your energy or your dog won’t listen. And basically like, my background is science. Like I’m a physiotherapist. And like, I love science. I’m that geeky guy that actually reads through the journals of things that’s posted in the news.

So I’ve always been really good with dogs. And, um, yeah. When, when people talk about energy, basically what they’re talking about is stress or cortisol. Like the hormone cortisol and cortisol is something that’s designed to enter your body really fast and then exit again. And like the lives we live today is so stressful.

So we drip cortisol all day. So for a dog that has a hard time listening to their owner, it’s very often it’s not being disobedient. It’s basically them trying to figure out where we are, what’s like the relationship we have. Am I guiding you? Or are you guiding me? And it has nothing to do with dominance.

And I’m like being a hard leader or being a soft leader. So I do not do bite work because that’s you’re responsible to do that online. But basically I help everyone, like every regular Joe or everybody who has normal problems, but maybe I’ve tried dog training without getting results. And then they want to see what science can actually back them up with.

So, yeah, it’s a lot more fun than when I do it this way and get a lot of hate, like doctrines hate me for some reason.

Joel Erway: [00:05:21]

Still in business for them. When you were first started out in 2015, you said you’re doing explainer videos, right?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:05:31]


Joel Erway: [00:05:32]

What was your offer back then? Was it the same offer that you’re selling now?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:05:38]

Like when I explained the video style, I was trying to go into B2B. Because, like, I thought it was, uh, I joined a master mind it was really cool. And it still is, is really cool. Like a community there, just like we have in high ticket courses. But, they had a template like to this, this, to this business.

So I went with the explainer videos because I thought that was cool. Um, no, no, like, I didn’t really know anything about offers, so I just try to make the best of it.

Joel Erway: [00:06:12]

What was your offer then?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:06:14]

Uh, don’t remember.

Joel Erway: [00:06:16]

Oh, you don’t remember?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:06:16]

That was a long time ago. I hated that business model. Like, um, I’m sure I like, I have friends that make a lot of money on it, but I just hated it.

Joel Erway: [00:06:25]

Yeah. Okay, cool. So when you, um, before you joined the program, right, like what was the one thing that you wanted to get out of it? Like what was the one thing that you really wanted to learn?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:06:41]

How to get clients from paid ads. That was my, I was so sick of organic. Like I’d still do some organic stuff, but I was so sick of, you know, and I know you heard this in the groups that like so many times before, but people who only wanted the free stuff, they spent a lot of time searching online.

And they have like being on sales calls after sales calls, after sales calls with people who do not have the ability to buy, it’s so frustrating, like having 10 sales calls lined up and having a good script to follow and still not getting the sales. That’s it, it sucks. So, yeah, I wanted to know.

Yeah, it really is. And like, I really wanted to do, like, again, my get out of the organic parts because when people get advertisements and you already make the offer up front, they’re not going to expect to get it for free. So, yeah, that was my one big thing.

Joel Erway: [00:07:53]

I want to talk about your price for a minute.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:07:55]


Joel Erway: [00:07:56]

The price of your program is what was it? Uh, if I remember correctly, was it a thousand dollars?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:08:02]

Joel Erway: [00:08:03]

Yeah, yeah.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:08:04]

Right now I sold the course only for a thousand dollars or euros. And then I sell group coaching for 3000 and I sell one on one for 6,000.

Joel Erway: [00:08:13]

Excellent. Wow. Okay. So that’s way more than I thought what you’re selling it for.

All right. So. How does it, how does it spread out? Like on average, how many people take up on one-on-one? How many people take you up on the group and, and do it yourself?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:08:28]

Very, very, very few on one-on-one. I’m not that great at sales calls. So I saw them down. Mostly go for the group coaching because like, if you really have a problem with your dog and you’re going to need coaching.

Like, no matter how good my courses, you’re going to need someone to explain certain situations for me or for you. So most people don’t have a really hard time going up to like, or staying on the 3000 level, but some actually do want to just pay for the course and genuinely these people don’t have a lot of problems.

They just need a little bit of tuning.

Joel Erway: [00:09:13]

Have you always been selling your program for three grand? And you know, that tier structure?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:09:19]

No, uh, like I learned this from you. So I’ve tried to like say several ways. Like in my previous I was in a group mastermind before I joined high ticket courses, whereas actually, where I heard about you.

So that was pretty cool. And then I tried starting at a thousand and I figured out, like, it’s not hard to sell 4,000, a lot of difficult sales, but then I included like eight weeks of coaching with it. So when I had like five or six different people that will coach every week. And I did that one on one, so that like, it turned into a little bit of a mess because I didn’t like all the logistics knocked in, so I would get someone on Tuesday and it would be too soon because they didn’t finish the videos.

And then I would get a bunch of them on Thursday. And yeah, I just turned into a little bit of a mess. So my price point, like I figured to sell it for 1K. I could probably sell it for 3K and I was right. And I’m at 6K. That’s a hard sell for me. That really is a hard sale, but that’s because I’m not that good of a sales person.

Joel Erway: [00:10:39]

Yeah. I think you’re just, I think you’re a little too hard on yourself right now, but, you know, I think that if the market might just might not go for that. I mean, you’re in a consumer market. Right? You know, and that’s what, one thing that I want to stress to people right now is that high tickets are relative to the market.

Like what, how much do people spend on dog training on average, like is $3,000 average or like, are your competitors selling low tickets? Like what is, what are the other price points in your marketplace where people who are selling comparable, comparable offers.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:11:15]

Well, um, it differs like if you want a good dog trainer, that’s expensive.

So 3K is not like an insane sale at all, it’s, it’s not insane. A lot of the people who do stuff online are in like 25 bucks to 50 bucks, 130 bucks for online stuff. And some of it is actually really good. I bought a lot of it just to see what I’m competing against. And some of it is just actually really good, but they, these guys follow the value ladder.

So they up-sell it all the time. And so they kind of do it differently than what we do. I’m more comfortable doing this to be honest. Yeah. 3K is not a hard sell.

Joel Erway: [00:12:07]

When did you make your first 3K sale? Do you remember?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:12:11]

Yeah, I said, you know, February of this year.

Joel Erway: [00:12:17]

And was it from ads?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:12:20]

No, that was organic.

Joel Erway: [00:12:22]

Yep. Okay, cool.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:12:25]

But I had a big milestone yesterday. Yeah, actually I remember talking about the closing people on messenger? So I closed my first client on messenger yesterday. It’s only a 1K sale, but it’s still closed on messenger. So, yeah.

Joel Erway: [00:12:44]

That’s awesome, man. That’s awesome. So before you joined, like, and you learned about this whole process and whatnot, and like, what were some of your hesitations, like, obviously you wanted to come in, you want to learn how to sell with paid ads? Like what were some of your concerns before you pulled the trigger?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:13:04]

Well, I’m like you know how it is. There’s a lot of gurus out there who sell you something. And then that’s one of the things that I’ve been caught on before that people sell you on what you want to hear, and then they give you what they feel that you need. And that’s probably pretty smart, but in my case, I just, I didn’t want to get another job, you know, organic marketing before you can outsource it. That’s a job.

It takes a lot of time to edit videos and film videos. And I’m sure like some people have structured it to the point where it’s not that difficult and just shoot a lot of content, like, like you do, for example.

But I remember a while back, you said, don’t worry about it. Like you can do a lot of organic stuff because you earned it. And that resonated with me so much because like when I post clients from ads now, I know that okay I spend anywhere from in the best weeks I’ve had, I’ve spent like $10 and get a sale for a thousand, which is pretty cool.

But I haven’t been stable. I haven’t been stable, but like I say, let’s say I spend a hundred bucks and I make a thousand. Which is pretty insane. And if I make like 900 or 1000 out of a sale, but I don’t have to spend time making 25 videos, that 900 of pure revenues, it tastes so much better.

Joel Erway: [00:14:45]

Yeah, I love your market, man. I really do. On average, how much does it cost you for an application or a phone call? Like what’s your average?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:14:57]

That is difficult because I’m not stable. Like it’s up and down. Like at one point I was a book 10x of what I put in and then it just dropped like a bomb.

So let’s say $20 for an application. 20 to $30 for an application. But I also found, and this is something that’s kind of weird and I don’t know what it’s telling about the way I’m doing stuff, but a lot of the sales I’ve had have come straight from the power offer. So right now I’m working on trying a pure power offer.

Nothing more and just contact me. So I’m going to test that out and see how that works for me, because usually I thought that the people who would comment on the ads and ask about price and stuff, that they wouldn’t buy. Turns out a lot of them actually do buy. So that was like an awakening for me.

And yeah, like I spend time in messenger with them. And I do follow the high ticket courses process pretty nicely. And some of them just want to jump on a call straight away and because I run my businesses like I do, sometimes I just ask them, do you want to hop on a call now? And they, Oh yeah, that would be great.

So yeah, I don’t really know the price points of applications and stuff like that, but I do make sales.

Joel Erway: [00:16:35]

When you discovered the power offer, right. Was that like, did it make sense to you? Did you, did you trust it? Were you skeptical of it? Like, what was your, what was your opinion of the power offer that when you first learned about it?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:16:53]

Like when I first learned about you, I checked you out head-to-toe. I watched everything you did before I even contacted you. I remember sending you an email and asking you, because I found, I dunno if you remember this, but I found an expired link to buy your course. So I actually bought the old version of high ticket courses. And you were like, yeah, it’s cool.

It’s my fault. I didn’t take it down. So if it still works, just go ahead and purchase the program. And I did that and my, I didn’t have skepsis when it came to the power offer, because I did a lot of research on you and it made a lot of sense and it made like my first try, my very first try.

I have a small group on Facebook, which is like 180, 190 people. And I just made a post. I just tried it like the first, like it was a draft, the first draft I made of a power offer, I just posted it and I got a sale.

Joel Erway: [00:17:59]

Funny how that works. Huh?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:18:02]

Yeah. It’s liberating.

Joel Erway: [00:18:09]

Does it go against what you had learned previously? Right. Like the idea of marketing, marketing, and marketing, and eventually somebody is just going to ask you if they can buy something from you. Like how did, what did you think before you learned the power offer? Like, what was your mentality with marketing before the power offer?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:18:29]

My mentality was kind of, because I was sick of organic marketing. But yeah, I was following the value ladder very much and just to pay for the ads first, but I never really had any success with ads before trying power offers. So Mark Zuckerberg has made a lot of money with me, but it didn’t didn’t give it back.

So yeah, the power offer, it was cool because first and foremost, people expected to be offered something. And what I found was like, when you have people who are so frustrated because their dogs are acting a certain way and it truly affects people. And when you see people there, they’re actually ashamed of bringing their dogs out and in public because their dogs can’t behave.

And these people, they see that you have the solution or they think you have the solution. They’re so relieved. They want to give you the money. And so basically we found like posting a power offer takes away the need for being salesy. Like I posted in the group a few weeks back, that I have my shortest sales call ever.

It’s like 15 minutes, less than that. And I used to spend one hour going through a script point to point, like, check this out, check this out, check this out. And I felt bad for some of the people that I wasn’t called for because you’re pushing on their pain points so much. And the power offer reduced the necessity for that.

Joel Erway: [00:20:21]

It’s because you’re, pre-selling, that’s what people don’t understand. That’s what people don’t understand is, when you’re able to pre-sell and just be upfront with people, right? Let them make the decision on their own, turn that sales call that you’re used to doing into a Q and A call. You don’t have to be good at sales.

Like I’m not good at sales either. In fact, I’m the antithesis of a good sales person. You get me on a sales call and if I have to follow a script, I can guarantee you I’m going to, I’m not going to close anybody. Right. So, you know, we’ve all been there. Anyone who’s been in this game any length of time has grabbed some sort of sales script.

Like, you know, this is powerful stuff, man. If you get the sales script, if you get this, this is like printing money, right? Give me a break.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:21:19]

Yeah, that was my experience at all. Like it’s not like printing money. I remember this one call. I felt so bad. I felt so bad afterwards because first of all, she didn’t have any money. Like she was broke, she just wanted help. She booked the call with me and I followed the script that I was taught and she started crying.

Yeah. It turns out that she really did need help. And so I helped her out. I did it for free because I felt so bad, but Hey, you learn.

Joel Erway: [00:21:57]

You live, you learn, man. I hear ya. Dude, if there’s one piece of advice that you could give somebody who is in a similar situation that you were in before joining High Ticket Courses, maybe they’re doing organic marketing or maybe they’re, you know, on the fence, like, Oh, you know, I don’t know if this is for me. Like, what would you, what would you say to that person?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:22:18]

Make sure you want to do this for a living. If you’re sure that you want to do this for a living then, like, I wouldn’t go and buy anything else in high ticket courses, because it’s so easy to follow.

Like that’s the, that’s the truth. Like your videos are somewhere between 7 and 20 minutes long. That’s easy to follow. Okay. You can pause and you can do what you need to do. That’s easy to follow. I’m a busy guy. I have like two companies and yeah, like the masterminds I’ve been in before, when you have 1 hour 45 minutes of content and you have to watch four of these videos every week.

That turns into so much. So if you’re serious about you wanting to make something happen online and you’re willing to actually put in the work and you’re willing to test stuff, because you’re going to have to do that, then go ahead and buy the course. If you’re not sure if you want to make this your living, then go do something else.

Don’t fiddle with it. Go all in.

Joel Erway: [00:23:24]

Yup. You gotta make that commitment to yourself. You absolutely do. You know? And there’s lots of training out there, right? There’s lots of training that makes you money and you have to determine who you want to follow, who resonates with you above all else? Like I’m not the only person who teaches marketing.

I’m not the only pure person. It teaches you how to create offers. But yeah. You got to find who you resonate with. And you’ve got to find that style methodology, and you’re going to find some people and you’re going to buy into their programs and it might not be for you. And it’s all part of the learning curve, you know, it’s, it’s all part of the entrepreneurship process.

And dude, I’ve loved following your story. And I remember when you emailed me. So just for clarity, I do remember when you emailed me because I was raising the price.

So the old price, the old price was about to expire and we were raising the price. I think at the time I was going from a 1000 to 1250. We’ve since gone from 1250 to 1997. We’re now going even higher than that.

So I don’t know when you’re listening to this podcast, but there you go. That’s my price progression of this program, but it was right when we went from I think it was 1000 to 1250 and you’re like, and I think, I don’t think we had done it just yet. And you paying me like, yeah, we’re raising the 1250. So if you want to get in like get in now, or maybe it was 1252.

The 1997, I can’t remember, but it was one of those escalation points and you were the, you’re the final person to get in at that lower price point. I remember you’re very ecstatic. So, yes, I do remember.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:25:04]

Oh, that’s cool. That’s cool. But yeah, like for those who wonder. It’s not only like the way you teach marketing, because I enjoy the fact that you’re talking about ads though.

That’s my thing now. I love it. But I remember having some struggles and I was talking in the group and I had no idea who this guy was and I don’t know where it was, some superhero called Cody Neer just jumped on and just texted me and chatted with me. I know Cody, he was super successful and was the kindest guy in the whole world and just helped me out a bunch.

And that’s like the most important thing for me is like, you actually have really successful people in the group. Like I’ve been talking a lot with some of the other members as well, and that’s truly amazing success. And everybody’s so helpful.

Joel Erway: [00:26:06]

Cody was on the podcast. I’ve never seen anybody do what he’s done, which is launching 21 power offers in a span of like two weeks.

Like it was just absolutely ridiculous, but yeah, Cody is great. And it makes me so happy and so proud to hear you say that about our members. Cause that’s a big focus of what we’re doing now moving forward with building our mentorship program and building a stronger tight knit community.

So I’m very honored and excited to hear you say that. So, Alfred man, it’s been a pleasure. I’m very excited to see your progress and excited to see you continue to grow. Once you get in the ads game, it’s like crack and you’ll never go back because it’s the exact reasoning you talk about.

Organic is tough. We do tons of content marketing now, but I’ve got a team of five people that post daily, like two or three or four times a day on my team full time. So it’s a lot of work. There’s no doubt about that. I just hop on my phone. I do my rucking with Joel videos, but, yeah, ads are fun. And once you crack the code, it’s, there’s nothing like it.

So, awesome. Well, thank you so much for sharing your story, Alfred. What if we have anyone who’s a dog lover who’s listening to this and they want to learn more about your dog training, where can they check you out?

Alfred Karlsen: [00:27:40]

Well, easiest way and I’m most active on Instagram. So @alfredkarlsen, A L F R E D K A R L S E N, on Instagram, that’s me.

That’s where I’m most active and send me a message, I’ll reply within the day.

Joel Erway: [00:28:00]

Awesome. We’ll make sure to include that on the show notes. Alfred, thank you so much, man. It’s an honor to hear your progress in your success as a fellow B to C customer. Yes. This even works with B to C. It’s probably the number one question that I get from people is, Oh, does this work in the B to C niche?

It’s like if people buy stuff, the power offer will work. So.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:28:22]

Yeah, it’s cool. Uh, I’m like I have less sales calls, but I still get qualified leads. So yeah, it’s power offer works in B to C.

Joel Erway: [00:28:32]

Awesome. All right, thanks again, Alfred. Thank you so much for tuning in and if you reach out to Alfred, just let him know you heard him on Sold With Webinars. Give him some love, and we’ll see you all in the next episode. Take care.

Alfred Karlsen: [00:28:45]


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