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Sold With Webinars

How Brendan Kelly Went From Burned Out Webinar Pro To Launching Mini Webinars For Clients | #123

Brendan Kelly
Tags: HTC Courses, Webinar Pro, Launching, Mini Webinars, High Ticket Courses

I talk about Mini Webinars all the time, right? All. The. Time. 

But in this episode, I get to talk with someone who is just as passionate about Mini Webinars as I am. Hard to believe, I know!

But Brendan Kelly is not just a Mini Webinar guy, he’s also a High Ticket Courses student.

You’ll hear how he got into e-commerce after graduating from college, sending out 100 resumes and getting ZERO response. Nada.

His online journey includes literally selling stuff from out of his parents’ basement on eBay; building a successful Amazon business that got shut down overnight; and then diving head-first into webinars until finally discovering my mini Webinar system.

You’re going to like his story.

You’ll Discover

  • How Brendan reduced his workload by 80 percent — and got better results — by switching from long-form webinars to Mini Webinars [05:05]

  • How Power offers and Mini Webinars work for ANY kind of business, not just the “make money online space” [08:52]

  • Why using core keywords in your ad copy and Power Offer helps Facebook target your ideal prospects [15:35]

  • How Brendan Uses a “self-guided sales call” strategy to close super-hot leads ASAP [24:32]

  • Why Brendan refers long-form webinar clients to someone else! [38:52]

…And much more

Helpful Resources

Join our free Facebook group, Million Dollar Course Marketers.

Want to launch a High Ticket Course to grow your business without adding more work? Watch our brand new webinar.

Interested in working with Joel one-on-one? We’ll deliver a finished mini-webinar funnel to your OR will give you a detailed Game Plan you can go implement yourself – Apply here.
Subscribe to the podcast: Youtube, Apple podcasts, Google podcasts, Stitcher.

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Episode Transcript

Brendan Kelly: [00:00:00] 

Here’s the thing: it’s going to cost us a lot of money to produce. It’s going to take a lot of time, probably one or two months. We have to create like a 40 step follow up sequence. And we don’t know if it’s going to work.

Joel Erway: [00:00:17] 

Hey everybody. It’s Joel Erway here and welcomes to another very special episode sold with webinars. If you hear me chuckling right now, this is the third time I’ve tried to do this podcast intro. I am very excited. I finally got it right. Very excited today. I have a very special guest on the call, Brendan Kelly, and we are going to be talking about all things.

You guessed it, mini webinars go figure, right? Probably for the past three years of her, we talked about this over and over and over again. But today is the first time that I’ve actually had another mini webinar expert, another mini webinar, aficionados, somebody who builds these for other clients. I’ve never had anybody on.

Where we can just talk about all things, mini webinars, someone who’s gotten great results. Somebody who knows the inter a B intricacy at the details of what goes on behind all this stuff. So I’m very excited. Brendan, welcome to the show, my man.

Brendan Kelly: [00:01:14] 

Joel, what’s going on men? Thank you so much for having me on. I’m hyped to be here.

I hope to share it with the audience. I think as you said, we’re going to have a really cool conversation because. You know, it’s unique. I always hear about how other people are using, you know, the mini webinars in their own space sold with webinars. So to bring this sort of perspective as a service provider, who like you, you know, used to write a lot of long-form webinars, and now is transitioning over to these mini webinars because they are just way more efficient and overall better.

You know, we both have a bias here, but, yeah, it’s going to be a great conversation. Thanks, man. Yeah.

Joel Erway: [00:01:47] 

I’m excited, dude. I mean, we’ve had a few conversations in the past, you’re a student of mine. You’ve joined high ticket courses. That’s where you learned how to do these mini webinars and you’re getting some incredible results for your clients.

So why don’t you give us? Let’s start out. Give us a little bit of background about your story, about, you know, your journey. And then we’ll jump right into some nitty-gritty details about what’s working now in the world of mini webinars. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:02:15] 

So I’ll give you a quick and easy story. I mean, I’m still a pretty young dude, right?

I graduated from college like two and a half, three years ago now. And basically, I went and graduated. I studied PR, never did anything with it. I applied to over a hundred jobs in New York City and got zero responses. So I was forced to kind of figure things out for myself and I jumped into e-com. I ended up selling like everything in my parents’ basement, you know, on eBay.

That’s how I got started and got my couple of thousand bucks online. And, you know, I was hooked from there. Got into Amazon, but a little private label brand sold like 50 K in about six months on there. That was like my first day you’re dry. And then from there, you know, my Amazon business basically got shut down overnight due to blackout tactics.

I discovered funnels through Ryan Daniel Moran. It was actually on his podcast. He basically was like, Hey, you know, expert secrets, you know, Russell Brunson, your book’s going to take me at least $10 million this year. So I went and got the book, you know, got addicted, was indoctrinated to the whole ClickFunnels world.

And then, you know, did a lot of funnel building for a while, discovered webinars, took on a webinar client, done for you, got some success and then sort of just dove all in on webinars and became the webinar guys. So, that was all in the past few years, but you know, as you know, like long form webinars, man, they are exhausting to write.

I mean, it’s usually 200 slides. It’s a two-hour presentation. It’s insane. So when I discovered you and what you were doing and I think like the first time I ever saw you it was like a testimonial on somebody else’s page. And I saw the webinar agency and I’m like, Oh, who is this? I don’t even know.

You know? So I went in and I saw what you’re doing. And like right there, I ended up buying the course, like a couple of weeks later, ended up launching my first mini webinars, like a few weeks after that. Like, it’ll happen very, very quickly. But, yeah, that’s my quick backstory, you know? 

Joel Erway: [00:04:00] 

What was the first webinar that you wrote, right? That first client? What was the product? What was the niche industry? 

Brendan Kelly: [00:04:07] 

So it’s the first webinar. It was an options trading webinar. So it was for a trader I’ve worked with, you know, two traders and one investor. Now I’m all doing long-form webinars and they all did pretty well, but yeah, it was an options trading webinar for beginners.

And you know, I followed Russell’s perfect webinar system very closely and, you know, I’m not an ads person. Like it was all kind of out of nowhere. Right. But at first, it was like week one, was like a bust. Week two, was a bust. Week three, we got like one sale. And then we four, we got like six and seven or something like that.

And then from there when really, really well. So yeah, that was the on options trading. And since then we’ve done a whole bunch more, but you know, it’s, it’s an evolution for sure. 

Joel Erway: [00:04:49] 

So how many, so when you’re in the webinar space, right? How many clients, how long did you stay in the webinar space being like how many clients did you work on?

Like, and when did you kind of hit you? Like, this is a lot of freaking work. Like I need to think of some other, 

Brendan Kelly: [00:05:05] 

I did probably a couple of dozen, you know, I don’t know, I never went back and put a number on it, but it was tough because. I was doing a lot of one-off projects, right. So I was sort of like this one-trick pony who could write really good copy and make a good presentation and make it convert.

Right. I didn’t have all the other pieces. So I was literally killing myself, writing these two-hour webinars that were 200 slides and you know, literally doing it for like a one-off fee. And I didn’t have all the case studies. I’d never heard the results that I have now. So I was doing it relatively cheaply.

So I was just putting in like so many hours doing really intense copywriting, which you know, is like very mentally taxing, and eventually, I was like, this is not sustainable. So when I, when I saw you, it was like a breath of fresh air and I’m like, Oh my God, you’re telling me I can get these same results with 40 slides, not 200, you know, they’re crazy.5:50

Joel Erway: [00:06:01] 

So, when did you jump into the mini webinar game? How long ago was it? I’m trying to remember off the top of my head when we first connected, but yeah. When was it?

Brendan Kelly: [00:06:11] 

A few months ago now, if I had to guess like three, maybe four, I’m not sure. 

Joel Erway: [00:06:17] 

So you’ve been doing it for a handful of months, right. And you’ve gotten some success.

So talk about your first mini webinar client. Was it a success? Was it a learning experience? A little bit of both?

Brendan Kelly: [00:06:29]

Here’s the thing, right? I was doing those long-form webinars. They take a lot more mental energy and copywriting skills and testing and tweaking. Then one of these minis. So at least from my perspective, when I made the first one, I was just so thrilled that it was so fast, actually go and create. No, I got it up very quickly and we ended up getting results pretty quickly, but it was a client that I actually used to work with, and we ended up setting up a PLF.

She was a trauma counselor and we set up a PLF and we got a bunch of people through and we’re just getting a bunch of leads. Basically, she has this, uh, the service and it’s a three-day trauma intensive, where she helps people. She’s a faith healer and she does it in three days.

You know, people go from the worst things that could happen to live to, you know, totally capable people over three days. And it’s amazing. It is somewhat of a high ticket service. It’s $4,000, right. So we’re going a lot of people through and we got like a thousand leads and like, maybe it looks like one actual, uh, actually got one person to take us up on the service.

It was just insane. Right? So I saw this and I’m like, Oh my God. And I went back to it. I’m like, this could be perfect for you. And I actually did for free because I knew it would not take me very long. So I followed what we did in high ticket courses, literally went through at one time, busted it all out.

No, really easy to write for me because I brought somebody up in the long ones. And we got it up. And, you know, within the first couple of days she was getting appointments like it was like four days after we started running ads, she got her first sale and I was like, Oh my God, you know, this is, this is huge.

This is such a game-changer. So that was the first success. And then since then, you know, she could only do a few of these a month, but really like, we can almost get her clients on command. So it’s amazing. 7:50

Joel Erway: [00:08:10] 

So this was a non-business market, right? Like what type of market would you say this is?

Brendan Kelly: [00:08:18] 

Right. They had to be Christians. That was like the one qualification and they had to be going through some sort of trauma or have trauma in the past. 

Joel Erway: [00:08:26] 

Oh, trauma. I thought you were, I thought you were saying drama. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:08:29] 

No, no, no. She’s a trauma counselor. People come in, you know, you know, with all sorts of trauma, they’ve been through crazy stuff in their life and they’ve been carrying with them for 20 years.

And over three days she helps them and, you know, they’re, they’re free of their pain. So that’s the service it’s really cool. And she has a hundred percent success rate. It’s amazing. But yeah, we just couldn’t find the right people and get them through, you know, through the right mechanisms. So. 

Joel Erway: [00:08:52] 

I want to talk about that real quick.

Like, we’ll start there because this is really, really, this is a hot button for a lot of people who come into my world because they come in with a mentality. Joel, that’s, you know, this works for you because you sell marketing services, you sell, um, how to make money. It’s like, Ugh, like you got to open your mind a little bit.

Right? Cause we’ve had tons of success with people that are, I just had a podcast, the previous guests before this Alfred do dog training. Right. And so. Naturally, I attract a lot of people who are in similar space to mine, but like this is a lead generation mechanism, meaning like it’s meant to get these people who have a problem or interested in some sort of solution.9:00

It’s not to get them as quickly through your funnel as possible. It’s not exclusive for anyone who’s in the B2B space or just serving business owners. So in the trauma space, I’m fascinated with this. Do you remember what your angle was to come in and attract them? Cause like that’s got to be difficult, like, it could be very easy to attract the wrong type of person.

I’m assuming just from a marketing mind. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:10:00] 

Right. So, I’ll tell you what happened is we were getting a lot of really cheap leads. Um, there was like a dollar, you know, so like we’ve run other many webinars in the B2B space where a lead is like $6, but then our application cost is like 30, 40, 50 up to $80.

Right. These were really, really cheap. So we’re getting a ton and a ton of leads through. And I want to talk about what we did with all those excess leads in a minute. But, so the angle we took was like, Hey, this is totally different from traditional counseling, for two reasons, one, we bring faith into it and you know, there’s a lot of Christian counselors out there, but they don’t actually bring faith into the conversation.

So like her mechanism real quick was like, we look at the scenario from God’s perspective, right? And I’m not a super religious dude. I’m not a super political dude. I’m pretty neutral across the board, but that’s what it was. And to those people, you know, people who are really strong into their faith, like they believe in that was all they needed to hear was like, you know. 

Joel Erway: [00:10:55]

Can you repeat that? So like, what was, what was big, what was the big thing? The big idea. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:11:00] 

There were two things. Okay. First one, we look at the conversation, the scenario from God’s perspective, right? And then God is the one that heals you, not the counselor. And I put that in the ad copy. It’s like, I cannot heal you, but you know, who can. Right?

And that was like our long-form, the extended power offer when I wrote that out. And that’s when after you did that workshop, I rewrote it the next day, our lead cost drops like a third for an application. Right. So it was amazing, but that was the one angle we looked at it through God’s lens because he’s the only one that can heal you.

The second thing we did was this is a three-day intensive period. We are collapsing, you know, 12 months or more of traditional counseling into three days and there’s a lot of benefits to that, right? So you don’t have to go and visit them every week. It doesn’t take time out of your day, every single week.

You don’t have to revisit the pain every single week. Right. So those were the two big things, but what we really had was like every single person that she’s worked with, they’ve gotten amazing results. So I’d say that’s like one of the number one things. And when we could say, you know, you know, some people would say it’s impossible to heal trauma in three days yet we have a hundred percent success rate.

That’s like, okay. Boom. You know, so that’s a big selling point. Looking at it from God’s lens was a big selling point. And then the three days were a big selling point and that justified the cost, I believe. 

Joel Erway: [00:12:12] 

Yup. Speed. Right? I say it over and over and over and over and over again like time is universal, is one of the two universal values that people, that people have time and money.

And so many people think that it’s just money, especially if you’re looking at it from the outside and you’re like, oh, I’m not in a business space and I’m not selling money at a discount. I can’t make this well, then you have to go like another angle is go towards time. Cause that’s what everybody values.

Everybody values time and shorten results, or speed of implementation, whatever it is. 12;20

Brendan Kelly: [00:12:43] 

Yeah. And we’re doing the same thing right now. You know, it’s somebody that she knows who’s also a counselor. She works really deeply with anxiety. So, you know, she’s an anxiety counselor. She goes into trauma too, but then her husband does genetic testing.

So they look at the scientific and the physical side of anxiety. So we’re doing the same exact thing for them. And we’re launching that in probably the next few days. I’m excited to see the results on that, but I’m assuming it’ll be the same. 

Joel Erway: [00:13:06] 

Or that Christian counselor, what was her price point for the three days intensive?

Brendan Kelly: [00:13:10] 


Joel Erway: [00:13:12] 

4,000. And so she’s going after B2C, right? You’re not targeting like business owners? 

Brendan Kelly: [00:13:17] 

Right. Yeah. Yeah. And it’s cool because like I said, we’re getting a ton of leads and not like everybody was totally qualified, but we were getting six times the amount of leads coming through, then we would for a B2B client.13:20

Right? So it’s like, the numbers were exactly the same applications cost the same because of the volume at that cost, you know? 

Joel Erway: [00:13:37] 

Yep. So in terms of qualification with that offer rate, because it’s B2C. Did you find a higher number of unqualified applicants or like, what was the spread like versus going B2B?

Like you have to find somebody who is wanting to solve this pain now and willing to invest, you know, four figures to make this happen. Did you have any sort of qualification issues with that offer? 

Brendan Kelly: [00:14:01] 

Yeah. Yeah. So, and we talked about this a little bit earlier over voice message, but what we saw was that in the beginning, you know, clients there.

We didn’t have to do too much qualification. We were getting pretty high-quality leads. Now I don’t want to go all into Facebook and how it works and everything. But what I found at least that I think is happening is that Facebook’s algorithm tries to help you by bringing down lead cost, but it ends up bringing down the quality of application too.

Right? So we were starting to use lookalikes and, you know, targeting people based on our previous results and all the people that were already coming through the funnel. Cause we had a ton of people, right. We have a ton of leads coming through, said, all right, let’s go find more people like that. I think that actually ended up hurting us and the ones who were really serious, they came through and apply, but we stopped using lookalike audiences.

And we’re now going for really broad targeting saying, okay, we only want to target women who are Christian and in like the top 10% income. Right. So those are like our parameters right now on Facebook.

Joel Erway: [00:15:00]

Yep. So just for clarity, that lookalike audience you built with Facebook, that was lookalikes on leads, email opt-ins, is that correct?

Brendan Kelly: [00:15:11] 

We tried both. Right. And basically the applications were better than the leads, the leads that look like audience based on the leads were not a good audience, so we don’t use it at all. 

Joel Erway: [00:15:22] 

Got it. So, so. Yep. Keep going. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:15:25] 

Yeah. So that is the biggest problem that we really ran into right now. We’re solving that through the more broad targeting and letting our messaging do the heavy work for us.

Joel Erway: [00:15:35] 

That’s what I tell people. Facebook reads your copy. Like what you need to do is if you’re doing your targeting like you just need to like, give it a nudge. Say they don’t, here’s a pool of audience that like, go find like this, or I want you to start. Right. It’s like, I want you to start looking in this direction and that’s really all you got to do.

Your copy is what’s going to get it laser-focused and dial in. That’s why we tell people like, I’m that the first sentence of your ad, your power offer ad like you call out your avatar and you call out like you want as many of your core keywords in that first sentence because 15:56

Brendan Kelly: [00:16:09] 

So our first sentence of that ad copy and it’s super long, like super long is attention accomplished women whose trauma is holding them back from reaching the next level or something like that. Right. Very aspirational. 

Joel Erway: [00:16:23] 

Yeah, a hundred percent it’s like Facebook is going to use its clicked ad. Like people who are clicking on the ads, like that’s an indicator of like, Hey, they’re interested in that.

Like, that’s why we talk about that first sentence of your ad. Like you want as many of those keywords, that’s going to relate to your audience as possible because Facebook is going to read your copy. Number one, that’s going to be, that’s going to help target, like send it down the right direction. 

Number two, and when is clicking on that is another indicator. And like, it’s not as complicated as people make it.

Brendan Kelly: [00:16:57] 

Right. And so that’s something that we’re doing going off of that while we’re talking about the council that’s interesting is like I said, we were getting a ton of leads through probably, you know, six times as many as a B2B space.

Right. So we’re like, okay, we have thousands of leads now coming through that we’re not really pushing it to them any direction, because that is the core for business. Is that service, right? So I’m like, okay, what do we do? She has a Facebook page that has a bunch of Facebook lives on it. What do we do? We turned it into a podcast.

And this is really interesting because it operates, it functions really similar to what we’re doing right now. Right. So all the people that you bring on, they’re having amazing success. Yes. With high ticket courses and, you know, You bring me on, I’m going to talk about great things about it. And you know, it, we’re given a lot of value, but at the same time, you know, as somebody listens to this over and over and over again, they’re thinking about, okay, maybe I should get into this.

Maybe I should get into this. So that’s what we did is we took all of our Facebook lives and we redirected them, started a podcast. And now the backend of our email sequence says, Hey, go listen to the podcast, go listen to the podcast, go listen to the podcasts. And we’re taking, you know, basically the idea from module one or from step one in her process.

And we’re breaking it down and putting it into a podcast episode with a call to action before and after saying, Hey, you know, if you like this, you want more of it and if you’re interested in the three-day service to go over here. Right? So now we have all these people who are getting remarketed to and we’re in their head and we’re in their brains.

So that they’re actually signing up for a waiting list now to get on with her. And she has people that are like, Oh my God, I really want to work with you. I can’t wait. I’m working on getting the money. I’m going to hold this spot for like six months from now. Like literally and did they’re like so into it, just because they, we built that know like, and trust factor through the podcast after.

So we just had so many people going through that system that she’s filling up on the backend from the people that aren’t sending applications, which is crazy. 

Joel Erway: [00:18:39] 

I know. And it’s another thing that I talk about, right? It’s the reverse function of salespeople want to market, and then sell, like, that’s how they want to launch their offers.

That’s how they want to get into the marketplace. It’s like, You gotta do it the exact opposite, like sales first and then marketing, like, make that offer first, get them to raise their hand saying I’m interested in your offer, but maybe now’s not the right time. Okay. So offer first, then give them their marketing, that marketing Intel to warm them up and, and, and keep them warm because that’s when they’re the hottest when they see your offer, they’re the hottest.18:40

So, yeah. Use marketing, keep people warm rather than turning cold people into warm prospects, which is a much longer game, still does work, but you know, reverse the process, go sales before marketing man. It’s, that’s what I tell everybody. And not many people get it. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:19:27] 

So something to remember too is like, just because they didn’t apply the second they came through, it does not mean they’re not interested.

Chances are if they’ve made it through, they are very interested in it, it just might not be the right time. 19:27

Like yesterday I signed up for a strategy call with an agency to do traffic things. Right. And I’ve been seeing this guy’s ads for the past, like six months and I was not interested, but like yesterday I was in a situation where I’m like, okay, like this is going to work well for this client.

So if I can make it work, then it’s worth it. Right. So like, literally, if you would have stopped marketing to me, then I don’t know, I probably would have never found it, but because you showed up now when the time is right, it’s not like I ever didn’t want to service or didn’t think it was a good fit. Like he was the go-to guy.

Right. So we’re doing the same exact thing where, you know, we’re just keeping off mine. They already know that we have an offer available. We’re not being shy about it. And know when they are ready, they come to us or they’ll save up and they’ll wait, as they will literally, that’s what people are doing or saving up and waiting and then like reaching out to her and they’re saying, Oh my God, I’m finally ready. Right. 

Joel Erway: [00:20:25] 

That’s awesome, man. Okay. So we talked about your counselor-client, right? And we talked about how to not repurpose the leads, but we talked about what to do with leads that don’t, that don’t apply, that doesn’t convert. So let’s talk about some other, some other projects that you’ve worked on that have been kind of I don’t know if like.

I know you’re working with a mutual friend. I referred a guy over to you and you’re having great success with him. I want to say that for the end because it’s for a couple of reasons, what other types of whatever, what other types of markets have you worked in, in the mini using mini webinars with success?

Brendan Kelly: [00:21:08] 

Okay. So the other ones we’re building right now are the anxiety counselor. We are doing relationship coaching. And I just picked all these people up, like, you know, several weeks ago. So we were in the launch phase of a lot of them. Anxiety counselor, we were doing real estate investing and that’s going to be easy, win easy.

When I, that one’s going to hit probably a hundred K in the first month or and relationship coach. So those are the other big ones right now. A lot of coaches really, it seems like water being attracted because they just need a better way to sell the program. And you know, for example, like I just got a referral the other day and this guy was like, you know, we’re getting a lot of people coming through, but I’m sick of getting on phone calls and I’m sick of this and this.

And, you know, it was the qualification process that you teach through. You know, just reaching out to people and not letting them book a call, but instead just giving that personal touch thing, Hey, like, look, are you interested in here are our rates, things like that. So the texting process beforehand. So that’s become really big too, and people are coming to me just for that, just crazy.

Joel Erway: [00:22:09] 

Just for the texting process?

Brendan Kelly: [00:22:10] 

Yeah, yeah. 

Joel Erway: [00:22:14] 

Yeah. You know, it’s a different style, you know, that everything that we teach inside of high ticket courses is all about pre-selling. You know, I haven’t put an official name to it until recently, but it’s pre-selling and. The more that you can presale somebody.

I was having this conversation with one of my sales guys today, somebody that we’re training. Right. And love him to death. He’s extremely talented. He’s a go-getter. He’s extremely motivated. Jason, I’m going to give him a shout out on his podcast. So I had a need for somebody to handle some of our calls.

And so I asked him if he was interested and he said, absolutely. So he jumped in and he, yeah, he was a member of high ticket courses and he’s a member of our high ticket courses, mentorship program, as well as we paid. And he joined. And I made the assumption that he had already, like, just watched the training that I talked about with, with how I do sales with, with the text message prequalification and, and all this other stuff.

And he was so giddy and he wanted to learn so much like he bought all these other closer training programs, went through them all, and he’s like, I’m going to perfect this, like, I’m going to, I’m going to show Joel, I’m going to prove to Joel that I’m, you know, that I’m awesome. And like, I was super, I was super proud of them, but it’s, those are kind of the antithesis of those sales training programs because when I got on a call with somebody, number one, like.

They’re going to know the investment already. Like I want them to know the investment. I want them to know my methodology. I want them to know my branded language before I ever even give them the option to book a call with me.23:38 And so. He went like a week or a month and a half of doing calls without this pre-call prequalification process.

And we were chatting. I’m like, Hey man, are you doing this, this text message? He goes, no, I’m not. I’m like, oh, I’m like, okay, here’s the lead that just came through, does it for them and, and see it like, cause he went through like a cold spell and he had a lot of really close prospects, like. Probably should have confirmed it.

And I’m like, dude, just do the pre do the prequalification process. And so he did it and he closed them. As he goes, that was the shortest call I’ve ever done. He closed them. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:24:32] 

It’s cool because like the angle that I like to take on these mini webinars, it’s a self-guided sales call is what I’ve been calling like between the application and the testing process.

Right. So, like, I know you say like the webinars to sales guys. Right. But like they literally sell it themselves throughout the entire application. And what we try to do is like, get them on the second, the application comes in. True. So like I tell all my clients like, Hey, get your jot form app on your phone.

Like literally as soon as it comes through, look it over. And then it’s the guy, right. Because they’re hot. They want it right now. And if we, if we wait like two days or if we even let them book right there, and then they book two days out, So much happens in two days. And at that point, you know, they’re not in that same mindset.

So your best case scenario is to get them right on the call right after that. But, but dude, like we, like I mentioned earlier sometimes we’re, we’re closing them even getting them on the phone at all and it’s just through text and I’m like, okay, I’m ready. Let’s do it. Do you know? And it’s a lot of those, like those I like these people who are just like, okay, let’s go, let’s go.

I don’t need the information. Let’s just do it. What’s the price? Right. And they’d love it. They don’t even want to sit on the sales call. They’re just like I’m in. 

Joel Erway: [00:25:39] 

Yeah. Oh yeah. There’s a, there’s a whole wave of, um, and that’s a huge trend. This is a trend that I’ve seen over the past. I started seeing it three to four years ago.

Started over Facebook messenger. We hadn’t been closing deals over messenger. You know, everyone in, so we just launched. We did the prelaunch. Our HTC mentorship program hasn’t gotten on a single call. We have people that have enrolled already, and they were all, I asked them one question, then I gave them the price and it’s like a, it’s just like 70 or 80% close rate right now.

It’s insane. But do it properly when it’s framed properly, you don’t need those painful things. Excruciating 45 to 60 minutes of sales conversations. Cause it’s, nobody wants to be on that. 26:15

Nobody wants to have their entire life story spilled out and, and, you know, gutting the knife in their gut and rip it out and, and doing, using that manipulation to get them to be like, yes, I need help.

It’s like what the hell. I don’t need to do that. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:26:50] 

I think it’s like, You know, it’s the mindset. It goes back to a couple of things. First of all, like targeting the right person. We don’t want the people who we have to convince to want to work with us because they end up being bad clients or, you know, the people that complain a lot, right?

Like the people who struggle that you’ve struggled to sell are probably going to be the biggest pain always. And that’s what I’ve seen at least in my career. And I know that other people do too. The other thing that comes back to is, and I know you’ve said it a handful of times is. That unique mechanism, whatever it is.

Right. And when we can get them to show up and say, like, show up to the sales call saying, I want your thing. Like you, de-commoditize your entire program process. And at that point you could say, okay, it’s five grand, it’s 50 grand. And it doesn’t matter, right. Because there’s no longer a price attached to it.27:18

And like I’ve done this with people. You know, it helped other people try to build these mini webinars and they’ll try to put like a stack at the end. Oh, well, and we’ll give you this and this and this. I’m like, no, no, no, no. You are literally. Tearing apart and like putting a number on what you’re worth.

And when you do that, you literally just it’s suicide. Right? So when you can, when you can have them show up and say, look, I want your thing, your process, your mechanism, your whatever it is, your service, and that you can attach a name to it. If they’re saying that, then it’s their soul and it doesn’t matter what the price is, right?28:00

Joel Erway: [00:28:07] 

Yup. Yeah. A hundred percent, man. The first time you do it the first time it happens, like the first time he closed that sale. It’s that type of sale. Would that process it’s game-changer? Cause you realize that everything you’ve been doing in the past has been unnecessary and I’m not trying to take shots at my sales pros that are, you know, my friends that are sales pros and my sales trainers, like, you know what, there’s a time and place for everything, but I prefer to not put myself through living hell of trying to extract all this information.


And, and it always seemed like a bait and switch, right? I mean, I’ve been in these training programs where they, they reveal, like they positioned their sales script as like the freaking Holy grail.

Like if you use this sales script, like, Oh, this is, this is it. This is the thing it’s like, Get a freaking grip, like getting ahold of yourself. Like, I can’t remember any time, anytime that I’ve bought anything or somebody had to like go through that Holy grail script. But anyway, I just had to laugh because it was, you know, the first time I kind of discovered like, Whoa, there’s something, there’s something here.

Like, did you really just say yes to my offer? And I didn’t have to do all that stuff and Oh yeah, no, I believe in what you’re talking about. And I want it, so let’s make it happen. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:29:34] 

Yeah. And, and, you know, I think there’s a time and place for it. Like a, but especially when you’re just starting out, especially when you’re just trying to sell your first handful of people.

And especially when you’re not getting on, you know, 30 sales calls a day and you don’t have a team like there’s no reason to be doing all of that. That’s the way I look at it. 

Joel Erway: [00:29:51] 

What was the biggest revelation for you when you started doing mini webinars? Like, what was the first, like when you learned about this?

What was the big aha moment? That you saw, it was like, wow, like, yeah, this, that makes total sense. Like what, what was that first aha moment? 

Brendan Kelly: [00:30:10] 

The big thing. Well, what was attractive to me as a service provider was the fact that I could, you know, make these webinars very, very quickly, right. Cause it would take me a week or two weeks to write out a long-form webinar.

Whereas these are the bust out in literally a couple of hours like max. So that was amazing from my perspective. But as far as the reason that they worked. I love the idea of an implied high ticket, where we are making them an offer. We are not being shy across the board. Right? Like you look at every step in the funnel.

If you look at the power offer, like the ad copy, it says, Hey, if I got you this result, you know, and I offered to do it for you, with you, whatever would you be in. And like, that’s just so straight up. It’s amazing. Right. But, what it does is it, that was the big thing. It was like, we make offers all across the board from the ad copy to the opt-in page and you know, anybody who’s in high tech course and understands the opt-in page.

Like it’s an offer. It’s not, do you want this free thing? It is, Hey, do you want to work with us? By the way, we’ll send you this free thing. So you could see what we do, right. So, boom, we’re making an offer. We’re making another offer. And then we get into the actual application page and it’s like, Hey, we’re making them another offer.

You are one step away from having us get you this great result. Right. So that was the big thing across the board. And it’s like, no, we don’t need to market to them. If we have, have the right buyer in front of us, if we say, Hey, do you want this thing? We’ve got the result for other people. We can get it for you too.

Do you want to not like it, that’s it right. It’s not really an intense marketing copy. You know, it’s not difficult. Make them an offer, figure out what your thing is. And just make it all across the board and every step of the funnel, that was the big thing, as far as like mini webinar and why it works, it’s just implied high ticket.

Right? So like even in the presentation, even in our headlines, we will do this for you. We will do this with you. I will personally do this. Right. It’s an implied high ticket. They know that they are not getting on to buy a 997 course. That’s the big thing. 31:55

Joel Erway: [00:32:03] 

Yeah. You know, it’s funny. But the number of students that we’ve gotten in the course right now, a number of, you know, bonus intake calls that I’ve been on with my students.

Like so many people miss it. Like they miss that point. And I try to, I don’t know how more, how direct, how much more direct I can be, but you know, it’s, you nailed it. Like it’s you, you have to understand. The psychology of what we’re trying to do is exactly different than what you’ve. I guarantee you, it’s the exact opposite of what you’ve learned in all of your net marketing of all your digital marketing training programs in, in the past.

And if you keep holding onto that existing belief system, like you’re going to keep struggling. It’s going to. It’s going to suck. Like it doesn’t need, it doesn’t need to be difficult. Right. And if people aren’t responding to it, like you don’t have anything to hide behind, which is a good thing. Like, because it’s your offer and that’s the number one thing that people have to get right.

Is you have to get your offer right. So, you shared some numbers in our group a while ago about some application costs that you’re getting, we were talking about this earlier today on messenger, right. You’re working with a client right now. Who’s in the video advertising space. Right? Tell me a little bit about that project.

Like you don’t, don’t tell their name, but like tell me a little bit about how that project’s going. Yeah. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:33:35] 

So, that’s interesting because that was a referral from you again, and I appreciate it. So he actually came to me, he wanted to sell his course, right. So he had an agency, but he wanted to sell his course.

He already had the course it was created and everything. He just wanted to sell it to the masses. You know, the whole, I want the evergreen course. I want to make a lot of money. I don’t want us to touch it too much. That’s the dream. We ended up creating that webinar and doing like one or two JV opportunities.

But at the same time, we created the mini webinar because he was kind of making a big transition in the agency where he wanted to take on more clients. He wanted to reach out to, you know, He was, he was working for a lot of big clients that he would do a lot of volume for. So now he’s diversifying taking on more clients doing lesser volume, right.

Per less volume per client. Hope that makes sense. Yep. Yep, yep. Yeah. So basically we got it all set up. We did, along with webinar created it, it took like weeks to do. And then I created the mini real quick just because he’s like, Hey, I need this. Now it can be like, transitioned switch over. I’m like, yeah, sure, whatever let’s do it.

And we ended up launching it and. In the w we had the ads on for like 10 or 14 days. I don’t remember which one, but we ended up getting 40 applications. We closed nine of them and like four of them, I don’t think ever got on the phone. And, and they were coming in, like at one point they started, you know, I tested a bunch of different audiences.

They started at $50 and they went down to 30 and then there was one really, really good ad set that we just got like nine, $10 an application for, I would just push that one and then like, literally around like the 10 or 14-day mark. He’s like, Hey man, my partner’s really stressed out. We can’t handle it.

Like, can we turn them off for a while while we can recoup? And I’m like, I guess, yeah, sure. 

Joel Erway: [00:35:18] 

That’s the most frustrating part about these mini webinars. Is that like you get something that’s working so well, like, Oh, I got to shut it off. It’s like, okay, well now we’ve got other problems that we’ve got to solve.

Right. You create more problems, better problems for them to solve. Okay. And so did he design his own ads? Did he do video ads for this power offer ads? 

Brendan Kelly: [00:35:36] 

Oh yeah. Yeah, of course. I mean, that would be super hypocritical if we didn’t let you create the ad for it. Yeah. So, he created the ad. We ended up bringing in, yeah, non-clients equal, you know, over a quarter-million dollars in annual revenue after like the two weeks were on, it was like stupid, you know, And, you know, since then I’ve had people contact me and like, just literally just saying, I want that.

Right. So they reach out to me, they’re like, Hey, whatever you did for him, I want that. You know, so it’s crazy. 

Joel Erway: [00:36:05] 

Very cool. So if somebody, you know, on the fence with either launching their own high ticket offer or high ticket course, or they’ve tried to do it before in the past, like what would you, what would your advice be to them? 

Like that person who is kind of on the fence, they’re skeptical. They don’t know if this is going to work for them. Like what would your advice be to them? 

Brendan Kelly: [00:36:24] 

Yeah. I mean, so most people come to me still wanting a course, right? They’re like, I want my course, I want the 997, this and that. And I have to explain to them very nicely.

I have to be like, look, here’s the thing. It’s going to cost us a lot of money to produce. It’s going to take a lot of time, probably one or two months. We have to create like a 40 step follow up sequence. And we don’t know if it’s going to work. Meanwhile, we can get this thing set up for you in about a week.

And it’s probably going to put, you know, a 20 K in your pocket in the next, like two weeks. So like, it’s just a no brainer to go and start off with the mini webinar, with the high ticket offer and then transition and either up or down sale from there, you know? So if anybody’s thinking about going and busting out, of course, still at that 997, like.

Joel, we write webinars, many new books, and we are both saying how freaking hard it is. You’ve never done it before. It’s going to take you months and months and months. And there’s a really, really good chance it’s not going to work. Yeah. So like the fact that I can bust one of these out, or you can bust one out or even somebody who’s not writing webinars already, you can go and bust these out in a week or two and get the whole thing, the entire funnel up and going the webinar up and going a very simple sequence up and going and then test it and get results in like just a couple of weeks is like, it’s insane.

You know, it’s a no brainer. 

Joel Erway: [00:37:36] 

Yup. How did, um, so that just brought up something that I meant to ask you before. Like you said, you did the JV webinar for your, for your client, right? I’m the one who’s crushing it right now. How did that webinar go? 

Brendan Kelly: [00:37:50] 

I’m sorry, I didn’t hear too much back on it. I didn’t follow up. He did the JV thing and then it was a summit that we’re supposed to launch like a month later. So honestly, I don’t really know what happened with that information or if we got sales out of it, but. Yeah, we, we transitioned and pretty much our focus has been like strictly on here and now with scaling out the agency and he should be, you know, at a million dollars very quickly.

Joel Erway: [00:38:09] 

Yeah. That’s awesome. Yeah. You know, I’m an advocate for webinars. I’m an advocate for mini webinars. They just have to happen in the right order. They have to happen in the right process. As soon as we get off this call, I’m going to be working on my own new webinar that I’m doing tomorrow. So I just want people to know, like, yes, I still do webinars.

I still do them. And it’s, you know, we just, we put them in the right order. Because they have a place in marketing. They have a place in business, but so many people want to take that first step, like, Oh, okay. I, you know, I everyone says I got to do webinars. So I’m going to go launch my business with webinars.

It’s like good luck. Yeah. Good luck. I wish you luck. There is a better way. It’s not the way that I would, I would advocate. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:38:52] 

So now when, when people come to me and they’re like, Hey man, I want the long form webinar. I’m like, I’ll refer you to somebody that might be able to help you because it’s not worth my time and energy for, you know, what it’s worth for us and for the client.

And then, you know, it. It’s just so much easier. And that’s why, like our model we’re shifting over and like only starting with the minis now, because, but like, like you’ve said that, you know, you start out there, you get the results. It’s really easy to create the other one after two. 

Joel Erway: [00:39:18] 

Yep. Awesome. Dude, I love chatting. I love chatting and marketers. There’s always so much stuff that we can glean from each other. And I’m glad that people who are listening right now can be a fly on the wall of this conversation. If people want to reach out to you, like what’s, what’s the best way for them to do so? 

Brendan Kelly: [00:39:35] 

Yeah. So, the best place to find me, like I’m super active on Facebook. Go find me on Facebook, Brendan Kelly. If you want to go to our current site, like I said, we’re in the middle of switching and rebranding and stuff, but bkellyprofits.com. B K E L L Y profits.com. And that’ll redirect to the new one wherever this goes up, but, yeah, that’s the best place.

Now I lay pretty low. I’m not really there in the spotlight too much, but we do some really great stuff. So that’s it. 

Joel Erway: [00:40:02] 

Love it, dude. Brendan, man. It’s been a blast. I appreciate you jumping on the podcast. If you’re listening right now, go reach out to Brendan. Let them know you heard him on sale with webinars.

Give him some love and we’ll see you all in the next episode. Take care. 

Brendan Kelly: [00:40:16] 

Thanks a lot, man.

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